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-   -   1989-90 Full backs - question (https://www.cpfc.org/forums/showthread.php?t=282957)

stevek 23-11-2020 02:39 PM

1989-90 Full backs - question
 
Ok, this one is a bit niche, but it's one of those cases where I seem to have a gap in my memory (I'll blame it on the fact that I missed a lot of games that season as I was a student in Leeds).

Our first choice full backs at the start of the season were (I think) John Pemberton (right) and Mark Dennis (left). But Dennis didn't last long before getting injured, and Richard Shaw emerged.

My memory is of Pembo at right back and Shaw at left back (as for the FA Cup semi and final) but watching you tube videos from that season, it seems they often played on the opposite sides. Is that right? And when did they switch - was it for the Cup semi (when in fact Salako played almost as a left wing back at times) or was it before then?

Either way, it makes me feel better about shoe-horning Shaw in at right back for our best ever 11 wedding reception table plan back in 2009...

Bipe 23-11-2020 04:11 PM

Dennis might have been signed as the prospective first choice but he was injured at the start of the season and only came into the team mid-autumn, only to get injured again a few games later and not play again that season. So he can effectively be discounted.

Pembo definitely played left back at home to Millwall in the first half of that season, and my memory tells me that he played on that side a fair bit either side of the Dennis appearances. In the latter half of the season Shaw played on the left and Pembo switched back to the right.

But I might be talking rubbish as usual.

ian king 23-11-2020 06:49 PM

John Pemberton only missed 5 complete games all season at right-back. At Leicester in League cup he came on as substitute for Richard Shaw.

David Burke started the season at left-back. Then Richard Shaw - Mark Dennis and back to Shaw again. Gary O'Reilly and Phil Barber also had a couple of games in that position.

stevek 23-11-2020 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ian king (Post 15511869)
John Pemberton only missed 5 complete games all season at right-back. At Leicester in League cup he came on as substitute for Richard Shaw.

David Burke started the season at left-back. Then Richard Shaw - Mark Dennis and back to Shaw again. Gary O'Reilly and Phil Barber also had a couple of games in that position.

That would have been my memory. But if you watch a few games back on YouTube, you can see Pembo at left back with Shaw at right back.

Edit - eg the Millwall game https://youtu.be/Y693s_bbQX4 - look at their positions for pretty much all the goals.

ian king 23-11-2020 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevek (Post 15511910)
That would have been my memory. But if you watch a few games back on YouTube, you can see Pembo at left back with Shaw at right back.

I can only go by the appearances chart in the Palace programme that show Pemberton in the No.2 shirt. I fully agree that players are swapped around as tactics direct.

Pub Idol 23-11-2020 08:36 PM

Did Shaw cross from the right when Bright forced a great save from Keith Welch? That was Feb time.

stevek 23-11-2020 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ian king (Post 15512164)
I can only go by the appearances chart in the Palace programme that show Pemberton in the No.2 shirt. I fully agree that players are swapped around as tactics direct.

I think that's just because Pemberton just stuck with the number 2. But it seems to be that for a significant part of the season, when Dennis or Burke were not available or not picked, Pemberton played left back and Shaw came in on the right. Even in those days, numbers didn't necessarily mean position (eg Geoff Thomas played a number of games at centre back, but I think always wore the 8)

stevek 23-11-2020 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pub Idol (Post 15512201)
Did Shaw cross from the right when Bright forced a great save from Keith Welch? That was Feb time.

Yes, I think so.

tony 1947 24-11-2020 10:11 AM

John Pemberton wore the number 2 shirt in all the games he played but of course could have played at left back. Richard Shaw did have number 2 the first 3 games Pemberton missed Rudi Hedman wore number 2 in the others. The following season Garry Thompson had number 5 v Southampton but played as number 9. Older supporters will remember Dick Graham have different numbers than the position they played in !

SA Eagle 24-11-2020 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevek (Post 15510548)
Ok, this one is a bit niche, but it's one of those cases where I seem to have a gap in my memory (I'll blame it on the fact that I missed a lot of games that season as I was a student in Leeds).

Our first choice full backs at the start of the season were (I think) John Pemberton (right) and Mark Dennis (left). But Dennis didn't last long before getting injured, and Richard Shaw emerged.

My memory is of Pembo at right back and Shaw at left back (as for the FA Cup semi and final) but watching you tube videos from that season, it seems they often played on the opposite sides. Is that right? And when did they switch - was it for the Cup semi (when in fact Salako played almost as a left wing back at times) or was it before then?

Either way, it makes me feel better about shoe-horning Shaw in at right back for our best ever 11 wedding reception table plan back in 2009...

Dennis was already injured at the start of the season and didnít make his first appearance till later (Spurs?). I think David Burke actually started as LB. Shaw didnít emerge until much later after a short loan spell at Hull.

radiomike 24-11-2020 10:25 AM

Excellent memories of Pembo and Richard Shaw, two great Palace servants.
Sadly, Pembo just been sacked as Chesterfield manager . Not aware where Richard Shaw is now but he was one of Steve Coppell's top picks

stevek 24-11-2020 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SA Eagle (Post 15512661)
Dennis was already injured at the start of the season and didnít make his first appearance till later (Spurs?). I think David Burke actually started as LB. Shaw didnít emerge until much later after a short loan spell at Hull.

Not sure about "much later" - Shaw was in the team by the aformentioned Millwall game and that was in October.

SA Eagle 24-11-2020 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevek (Post 15512730)
Not sure about "much later" - Shaw was in the team by the aformentioned Millwall game and that was in October.

I only recall him becoming a regular after his Hull loan, which was in December 1989. According to Wikipedia he played 21 league games, 5 in the FA Cup and 4 in the League Cup, so he obviously was involved with the first team prior to going on loan (making my much later a bit of an exaggeration) with the loan maybe coinciding with Dennis gaining fitness and being able to join the first team.

Selhurst Celtic 24-11-2020 07:32 PM

Happy 50th, SA Eagle. :p

Palace Kebab 24-11-2020 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radiomike (Post 15512664)
Excellent memories of Pembo and Richard Shaw, two great Palace servants.
Sadly, Pembo just been sacked as Chesterfield manager . Not aware where Richard Shaw is now but he was one of Steve Coppell's top picks

He is Director of this business https://www.tornado-football.com

stevek 24-11-2020 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SA Eagle (Post 15512933)
I only recall him becoming a regular after his Hull loan, which was in December 1989. According to Wikipedia he played 21 league games, 5 in the FA Cup and 4 in the League Cup, so he obviously was involved with the first team prior to going on loan (making my much later a bit of an exaggeration) with the loan maybe coinciding with Dennis gaining fitness and being able to join the first team.

That would make sense. And maybe it was when he came back in that he played left back, but in the earlier games had played right back (though I recently say a video of the 5th round of the cup, and I've got a feeling he was right back then, so that may be wrong).

Oh - and happy 50th. All the best people were born in 1970.

gold76 24-11-2020 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevek (Post 15510548)
Ok, this one is a bit niche, but it's one of those cases where I seem to have a gap in my memory (I'll blame it on the fact that I missed a lot of games that season as I was a student in Leeds).

Our first choice full backs at the start of the season were (I think) John Pemberton (right) and Mark Dennis (left). But Dennis didn't last long before getting injured, and Richard Shaw emerged.

My memory is of Pembo at right back and Shaw at left back (as for the FA Cup semi and final) but watching you tube videos from that season, it seems they often played on the opposite sides. Is that right? And when did they switch - was it for the Cup semi (when in fact Salako played almost as a left wing back at times) or was it before then?

Either way, it makes me feel better about shoe-horning Shaw in at right back for our best ever 11 wedding reception table plan back in 2009...

I remember Shaw being shoe horned against Spurs in 92, to accommodate the much maligned Lee Sinnott and we getting creamed :sob:

bubbs11 25-11-2020 03:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevek (Post 15510548)
Ok, this one is a bit niche, but it's one of those cases where I seem to have a gap in my memory (I'll blame it on the fact that I missed a lot of games that season as I was a student in Leeds).

Our first choice full backs at the start of the season were (I think) John Pemberton (right) and Mark Dennis (left). But Dennis didn't last long before getting injured, and Richard Shaw emerged.

My memory is of Pembo at right back and Shaw at left back (as for the FA Cup semi and final) but watching you tube videos from that season, it seems they often played on the opposite sides. Is that right? And when did they switch - was it for the Cup semi (when in fact Salako played almost as a left wing back at times) or was it before then?

Either way, it makes me feel better about shoe-horning Shaw in at right back for our best ever 11 wedding reception table plan back in 2009...

Well you did ask Steve...

The full back positions were a right mish-mash all season with different combinations.

Left - Right

Burke - Pemberton
Burke - Shaw
Pemberton - Shaw
Shaw - Pemberton
Dennis - Pemberton
Pemberton - O’Reilly
Pemberton - Hedman
Shaw - Hedman
Salako - Pemberton
Barber - Pemberton



Our first seven games of that season we started with David Burke at left back and John Pemberton at right back. This of course included the 9-0 at Liverpool.

Game 8 - Leicester in the League Cup - Pembo was injured and Richard Shaw came in to replace him at right back. So Burke left - Shaw right. This is how it stayed for four games.

Games 11 - 13: Pemberton returns and yes, slots into left back with Shaw at right back.

Game 14: Away to Villa, Pemberton and Shaw switch. So Shaw left back and Pembo right back.

Game 15 & 16: Switch again, starting with 5-0 drubbing away to Forest in the League Cup. Pembo left - Shaw right.

Games 17 - 20: at home to Luton Mark Dennis comes in at left back with Pemberton right. Stays like that for a further four games.

Games 21 and 22 against Charlton in the league and cup, Dennis drops out and O’Reilly comes in at right back. So Pembo left - O’Reilly right.

Games 23 to 25 we go back to Dennis left - Pembo right.

Game 26 back to Pembo left - O’ Reilly right.

Games 27 - 30. Burke returns. Burke left - Pemberton right.

Games 31 - 36 we go back to Pembo left - Shaw right.

Game 37: Cambridge FA Cup Qtr Final. Switch again. Shaw left - Pembo right.

Game 38 we have Pembo at left back and Rudi Hedman at right back.

Game 39: Shaw left - Pembo right. Pembo is stretchered off.

Game 40 & 41: Shaw left - Hedman right. Home games v Derby and Villa.

Game 42: Away to Millwall. Pembo left - Hedman right. Shaw CB.

Game 43: Away to Norwich. Shaw left - Hedman right. Pembo CB.

Game 44: The Liverpool semi final. We play five at the back with Salako left back and Pemberton right back. Shaw man marks Beardsley in a central defensive position.

Game 45: Home to Arsenal. Shaw left - Pembo right

Games 46 - 49: Shaw left - Hedman right. Pemberton centre back!

Game 50: Last game of season 2-2 Man C. Barber left - Pemberton right

Games 51 & 52: FA Cup Final and replay. Salako left - Pemberton right. Shaw central man marking McClair.

stevek 25-11-2020 06:15 AM

Thanks, Bubbs

gold76 25-11-2020 07:47 AM

That was a real swashbuckling season, dodgy at the back but adventurous going forward, Humphrey and Young gave us that stability in 1990.


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